Home > General Politics > Do You Want to Know Why Unions Suck? Here it Is

Do You Want to Know Why Unions Suck? Here it Is

March 2nd, 2010

John Morrison
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Occupation: Teacher

This is from Fox News:

John E. Morrison, a 62-year-old a music teacher at Romeo Elementary School in Florida, is charged with lewd and lascivious molestation and one count of battery for allegedly inappropriately touching two female students, ages 7 and 8, in May.

Police said Morrison admitted to putting his hand in the 7-year-old’s pants to touch her leg and to putting his hand in the 8-year-old’s shirt to touch her chest, according to various media reports. They said he also admitted to touching the 8-year-old’s buttocks.

Morrison continues to get paid as he awaits his trial, which is scheduled to begin next month.

Tammy Clinton
Age: 39
Gender: Female
Occupation: Teacher

Tammy Clinton, a 39-year-old teacher at Farnell Middle School, has been charged with two counts of lewd and lascivious molestation and two counts of lewd and lascivious conduct after allegedly forcing a 14-year-old student to touch her breasts, fondling his buttocks, and enticing him to leave the campus twice so they could commit sexual acts.

Police said Clinton admitted to the accusations after her arrest, the Orlando Sun-Sentinel reported. She is banned from school grounds but will continue to receive her paycheck pending a complete investigation.

The L.A. school system has 160 teachers getting paid to not work

The housed are accused, among other things, of sexual contact with students, harassment, theft or drug possession. Nearly all are being paid. All told, they collect about $10 million in salaries per year — even as the district is contemplating widespread layoffs of teachers because of a financial shortfall.

Most cases take months to adjudicate, but some take years.

The Times says that it is extremely difficult for the district to fire teachers because they are union-protected.

New York City has “Rubber Rooms” that house hundreds of teachers at a cost of $35 million dollars a year. m

Is this a good use of taxpayer money? Paying admitting child molesters to sit and do nothing because the union is too strong. This is pathetic. If I did anything like this I’d be fired yesterday. No questions asked. Teachers unions (and almost all others) need to go away forever. There is no reason for our hard earned money to go to these sex offenders in the form of taxes just because they happen to belong to a union.

Do you agree? Disagree? Let me know what you think in the comments below.

Author: Derek Clark Categories: General Politics Tags:
  1. Peter
    March 2nd, 2010 at 18:41 | #1

    I whole heartedly agree…where are the rest of the teachers in the union on this I wonder? You know the ones that might get laid off cause of financial distress? I would think they would be the first to say wait a minute my collegue here is getting paid and is an admitted offender while I get laid off cause the school doesnt have enough money. I think if people want to have a union so be it thats their choice to give up personal gain by joining with the ranks and all getting what ever collective gain they can but they should be the ones mad about this cause its money that could be given to them.

  2. March 2nd, 2010 at 21:28 | #2

    @Peter
    That’s a great point. Think of all the teachers that have lost their jobs because of budget cuts around the country. It is ridiculous that we spend this money that could be used to fund the actual good teachers we do have.

  3. Lawson
    March 2nd, 2010 at 22:40 | #3

    100% agree! That is unless I can join one and also get paid to not work… :p

  4. Peter
    March 2nd, 2010 at 22:47 | #4

    @Lawson

    But if you joined you would move to change that rule because it hurts you and the rest of the good teachers which is what true unions are supposed to be about, helping the collective. Seems unions though have turned into monopolies of workers so biz can’t run efficiently. I dont have anything against unions cause the people joining just think they can do better as a collective then on their own. Thing is the good workers should be able to do individually and that would mean they would be held back by a union and they should leave though thats not happening and im not sure why. Could be the way the rules evolved like healthcare….no one planned for it to turn out this way it just evolved into a mess.

  5. March 2nd, 2010 at 23:24 | #5

    Yeah unions are great for all the mediocre workers out there, but they hold back good workers. This creates an environment where nobody has a desire to excel. It’s very similar to creating a mini communism-like society inside a business. It looks great on paper but in reality it fails. Just ask Detroit.

  6. Peter
    March 2nd, 2010 at 23:29 | #6

    @Derek Clark
    Exactly so why do good workers put up with it? Are there laws that evolved over time that forces all workers into a union? Why can’t a worker work at a plant and choose not to join the union? There must be a reason good workers put up with this cause it doesn’t make sense. Cause I believe all of these guys want to do better and make more money. Though from the sounds of it with the great health benefits and great retirement benefits maybe the unions have gotten a better deal then a good worker could get and until these business’s go out of business they won’t be able to revert back to a true cost of labor for the product going out the door.

  7. March 3rd, 2010 at 00:21 | #7

    @Peter
    I’m a bit confused as well, but I think mostly the companies have done a terrible job negotiating. At least with the auto companies, everyone was getting paid more than what the skills required were worth. Now the problem is that it ran the companies into the ground, forced them to go bankrupt, and many of the workers lost their jobs. But while it lasted there wasn’t any reason to go against the system.

  8. TJ
    March 3rd, 2010 at 08:16 | #8

    @Peter
    Generally the unions have cut amazing deals and as a teacher I’d think the perks of being in the union would definitely make me want to be in the union.

    Also, at least in terms of teachers, I don’t think opting out of the union would change anything for you. They would still pay you on the same god awful pay scale / rate as they do with the unionized workers so it’s likely in your best interest to just join the union.

    Part of the reason auto workers union got such great deals is because the management basically had to say, “It will cost us X$ to hire and train new people… These people want Y dollars to stay around”. While Y is generally greater than X it also has a down time where no cars will be built. So each side has expert negotiators the union’s side asks for the maximum they can until it makes more sense to hire new people and the management will accept a deal as long as it’s not more than their financial wizards calculate it will cost to replace / retrain / miss a season of cars.

    The problem is that the car manufacturers financial wizards failed, from the very beginning, to account for the steep decline in American auto sales, the rise of Japanese cars, the housing bust, etc. Their numbers were all very faulty the same way the numbers were faulty for the people investing in securitized mortgages.

  9. March 3rd, 2010 at 22:20 | #9

    It’s a double edged sword. While I can’t stand the teacher’s union because it protects them from everything, the teachers do need to be protected because American parents are losers. I hate to say it, but the majority of Americans are not accountable for their own actions or the actions of their children.

    For example, if a child fails a test, what is the first thing they say? “Damn it, my teacher failed me.” Fuck that…If you fail an exam, it’s because YOU failed. I bet TJ will agree with me on this and say that students are not accountable for their actions.

    Now, here comes a parent who can’t admit that little Johnny is messing up and thinks it is the teacher’s fault. He blames the teacher and tries to get him fired. The union protects against that. But, at the same time, because the teachers can’t get fired, they grow lax. I think the union should be weaker, but still needs to be there.

  10. March 3rd, 2010 at 22:48 | #10

    @Jacob
    Now you do have a point, but this can also be solved by administrators standing up for the teachers. There has to be a method by which a teacher can get fired. As it is if you survive past a year or two you basically can’t be fired which is silly.

  11. TJ
    March 4th, 2010 at 07:27 | #11

    @Derek Clark

    True, but have you really understood Jacob’s point here? I don’t think the Administrator gets to *do* anything. We have all of these regulations, mostly federal, describing the test scores students must get for a teacher to be considered competent. As a teacher it seems like it would be ridiculous to be considered an awful teachers because half of the howler monkeys in my classroom didn’t show up / smoked to much pot / have never completed an assignment and therefore can’t pass a fairly trivial test.

    There isn’t much for the administrators to do when society, backed by the federal government, have decided this is what makes a good teacher. Hell, in TN they are about to pass legislation that links teacher raises with student performance on standardized tests. Well, I guess those Urban teachers won’t be making more than there suburban counter parts anymore… because they sure as hell won’t be getting the big raises.

  12. May 10th, 2010 at 22:26 | #12

    Again; completely biased reporting. Why people who admit crimes continue to be paid is beyond me. I am pissed that this report somehow blames union leaders (Implied) for supporting the actions of the molester. These contracts between the workers and their employers were agreed to by management but it’s the worker and the union that always gets the blame, F@#K off!!!!
    The poor working stiff fights for just a little piece of the pie; it’s agreed to by management, and when management f@#ks up the union gets the blame. WHAT? Get your heads out of your @ssess.

  13. May 10th, 2010 at 23:32 | #13

    @Union Organizer
    I didn’t say anything about union leaders. I think that there is a problem with unions. If you’ve read many of my articles you know I blame the management plenty, they should have never agreed to many of the contracts that they do. That being said, many unions have been very greedy and lazy, and that is at least part of the reason the auto companies for example went bankrupt.

    I know people that work in these factories. They were told to stop working so hard because they were making everyone else look bad. Unions were a big part of the downfall of these companies whether you like it or not. If you are a good worker, you have no need for a union. All it does is protect and overpay the mediocre workers. If you are good, you should be getting paid more than guy next to you who goofs off and doesn’t get any work done.

  14. barbara
    September 2nd, 2010 at 21:59 | #14

    howler monkeys? maybe teaching isn’t the profession for you anyway. go do something else.

  15. tymcd
    September 7th, 2010 at 17:59 | #15

    @Union Organizer @Union Organizer - It was the union member who ‘f@#ked up’ and molested the kids, dumbass. How is that managements fault? Unions come in with all these demands to protect employees and management reluctantly agrees. Now molesters continue getting paid thanks to negotiators like you.

  16. Joe R.
    October 20th, 2010 at 18:10 | #16

    I know many teachers that hate the unions. For one, it inhibits being able to negotiate pay (although that’s tricky to do in the public sector anyway).

    But I think of it this way.
    We get rid of all these protections for teachers.
    First the bad ones are told to go find new employment (aka what happens to all of us when we suck at a job)
    Then the good ones, thanks to less competition, become more valuable, and can earn more (supply/demand in the job market FTW)
    Then teaching becomes a more attractive position, and more people want to enter the field. We continue bringing in new, getting rid of the unperforming, and boom, teachers have more money, and towns have better schools for their kids.

    Yes I know it’s not THIS simple, or at least probably wouldn’t work this simply. Also, I know a lot of it comes down to the environment at home (children of supportive parents normally do well, children of parents who don’t care, don’t do well), so abolishing the unions can only go so far. But it’s like fixing Washington right now. Vote out all the insane-brained liberals who supported the big social programs like the Community Reinvestment Act that put us underwater is a good start. It’s not going to fix it, though, ultimately we have a lot of work to do on our end. Example being how even in the information age, third party candidates are barely a blip on the radar, and even qualified candidates like Ron Paul needed to fly a party banner to get elected.

  17. steve
    November 4th, 2010 at 19:37 | #17

    I work for the railroad. I a embarrassed to say I am a unionist. Workers complain about the carrier always trying to take more and more away from us, yet they cowtail to every demand they make. Unlike a normal industry the railroads work more efficiently if the workers don’t follow the rules don’t do their jobs. Railroaders are a thing of the past. The old guys who trained me are surely turning in their graves at what has happened to todays railroader…..

  18. barry
    December 7th, 2010 at 00:52 | #18

    Take a close look at the properties shared by corporations which continue to gain power and influence over our lives:

    1 - The right to vote does not exist except for share holders (analogous to land owners) and even there voting power is in proportion to ownership.

    2 - All power issues from a central committee.

    3 - There is no balancing division of power. There is no fourth estate. There are no juries and innocence is not presumed.

    4 - Failure to submit to any order may result in instant exile.

    5 - There is no freedom of speech.

    6 - There is no right of association. Even romance between men and women is often forbidden without approval.

    7 - The economy is centrally planned.

    8 - There is pervasive surveillance of movement and electronic communication.

    9 - The society is heavily regulated, to the degree many employees are told when, where and how many times a day they can go to the toilet.

    10 - There is little transparency and something like the Freedom of Information Act is unimaginable.

    11 - Internal opposition groups, such as unions, are blackbanned, surveilled and/or marginalized whenever and wherever possible.

    Does corporate rule appeal to you? Would you prefer to have the freedom to bargain (collectively) for your freedoms?

  19. Martin
    December 30th, 2010 at 20:34 | #19

    Totally 100% Disagree.

    The Union doesn’t protect these people. If a teacher commits a crime, the Union doesn’t defend them…the person will have to hire their own personal attorney for representation and the union simply makes sure that the 30-20A process (thats how you fire a teacher with tenure) is carried out correctly. 99.9% of the time 30-20A doesn’t even happen because the individual resigns.

    What the original poster is asking for is that we remove all due process simply because its “easy”. Because every single teacher who is accused of touching a kid is clearly guilty, right? Wrong. Happens all the time, some kid makes up a story…well that teacher should have the right to defend themselves and not be fired over accusations. If we are going to fire teachers for simply being accused of an action, well why stop with teachers. I would like to accuse the original poster of stealing stuff out of my car last month….since we are dumping due process I suppose we should fire him/her from their job and then throw them in jail. Guess I win, but we all lose in the end right?

    Bottom line, this has nothing to do with unions. Period. If teachers were sitting in rubber rooms in NYC it wasn’t because they couldn’t be fired, but because administrators weren’t doing their job and going about the simple process of documenting this crap like they should have been doing in the first place. With the new law in place, any teacher in NY can be fired within 60 days of a 30-20A violation.

    Sorry people, but union’s work to make society better for everyone. This is just another case of a Rush/Glen Beck type attack that is covered with misinformation and outright lies.

  20. Kumar
    January 10th, 2011 at 21:55 | #20

    Teachers who teach well don’t get rewarded and teachers who teach poorly don’t get fired…Am I missing something?
    As a student at a public school, it’s upsetting how my peers education and my own are comprised and we are considered “lucky” if we receive a good set of teachers for our daily classes.
    All the students shouldn’t cross their fingers hoping they will get a good teacher next semester, they SHOULD get a good set of teachers…

  21. February 23rd, 2011 at 12:14 | #21

    This post is almost a year old, but totally pertinent to the situation currently with these num-nuts in Wisconsin and Indiana. I got here by googling unions suck, and this is the perfect illustration of that well-accepted truth.

  22. Sally
    March 29th, 2011 at 10:44 | #22

    @Kumar

    “Teachers who teach well don’t get rewarded and teachers who teach poorly don’t get fired…Am I missing something?”

    Unfortunately, you aren’t missing anything - teachers unions make sure teachers get paid even if they suck. Good teachers can get canned and bad teachers keep their jobs, depending on what was “bargained” in their contracts. This is why teacher (and other) unions need to GO. They have way too much power…our grandparents would roll over in their grave if they knew the mockery unions have made of themselves. This is not what they were intended for. Shame.

  23. jb
    April 4th, 2011 at 09:19 | #23

    Unions aren’t what they use to be. More or less they are out to get theirs along with protecting the ones that need to go. Now days employers aren’t the best and nether are unions, but with all this money or jobs supposedly coming you would think they would want to start cleaning up their image. Lets face it, the good worker gets screwed and the ones that screw up all the time seem to keep their jobs, doesn’t matter union or not, everyone needs to work. (@union organizer)if you union people can’t see that, then your not really behind every worker and part of the problem. people aren’t jealous, they are tired of working their butt off and hearing people whine about they won’t work it because it doesn’t pay enough or not getting enough breaks when they get paid off the bat what someone who works 2 years makes, me personally, i would like to be able to prove i am a good worker and show what i know. but on the side of the unions, they get paid pretty much an inflation wage which most employers need to start doing then maybe you wouldn’t half to worry about unions. each side seems to be only telling half the truth, or not being as worker friendly as they should be. As i said when it all comes down to, union management or non union management need to get their act straighten out soon or they are going to have problems.

  24. prmermen
    June 15th, 2011 at 16:28 | #24

    burn them all..sorry i get a little upset when stupidity is not delt with swiftly.unions are basicly a government with in its self collecting forced taxes which should be illigal..but some brain dead polititions see to much profit in it do stop them..

  25. SUSAN
    June 26th, 2011 at 14:53 | #25

    Ok, folks, let’s stop the ignorance. First of all, I am all for Business. Hello, we need JOBS in this country. I am also all for unions. How in the world do you think the middle class was formed? Go back in history and you will figure it out. Corporations don’t give a rats behind about you or any of you who hate unions. On the other hand, unions are required by law to protect even the worst offenders, not the best thing, but it happens. I am a perfect example of both worlds. I was in a union many years ago, then got promoted to a non-union job. Worked there for 15 years with a spotless record, good performance reviews, loved my job, until the “new boss” was hired. When that happened, guess what? I was terminated because she brought in all her cronies from her past job. I couldn’t stop it from happening. I was able to go back to my union position and I thank God everyday that I could. You CAN FIRE A UNION PERSON, you are just required to have a good reason. Laziness, lack of performance, attendance… All these things can get ANYONE fired, but the reason they don’t is because they have lazy bosses. There are good and bad on both sides. Don’t put down unions because you aren’t covered by one, they help to provide decent benefits and pay. As a matter of fact, you may want to form one of your own.

  26. June 26th, 2011 at 17:21 | #26

    “Corporations don’t give a rats behind about you…”

    They do if you produce for them. If you are a producer, then you can switch to a competitor in the case of unfair treatment and take your old employer to the cleaners. THAT’S how the “middle class” is actually “formed”.

  27. WILLIAM WOODWARD
    July 3rd, 2011 at 08:24 | #27

    To blame unions for the problem is both arrogant and ignorant, as all unions are governed by a CONTRACT. A contract being an agreement between TWO (2) parties means the school boards of these areas agreed to these terms, and at the next contract meeting they can work to remove or alter those clauses that allow for such inequities.
    I am a retired police officer, and would happily put people like this away for as long as the law would allow, ANOTHER CONTRACT tha is not uniform to all states, so you can plame the legal system too, fo being so slow.

  28. toledotim
    July 27th, 2011 at 20:06 | #28

    Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. Unions are as strong as their group. Their group put it into their contract to keep getting paid until proven guilty. If guilty; that felon has to pay it all back. We just want to cry about something. Unions are really good! The money and corporations have propaganda that they suck.

  29. TC
    September 11th, 2011 at 10:18 | #29

    Detroit fails, USPS failing, schools lag behind,
    common thread?
    Union Labor.

  30. Pat
    September 25th, 2011 at 04:52 | #30

    Teachers unions are the reason public schools suck it’s not because of the students I mean compare them to charter public schools that don’t have unions such as schools in Detroit Public school state test scores are around 40% which is terrible and compared to charter schools which is 100% pass.. That’s like comparing motel 6 to the MGM grand las Vegas.

  31. Pat
    September 25th, 2011 at 05:00 | #31

    And by the way Toledotim that is total bulllllllsh** there is probably hundreds of counts were teachers have been found guilty or admitted to such things and molestation, drug abuse, child abuse etc. And in some cases these piece of crap union teachers collected 4 years of salary before administration was able to get through the incredibly lengthly bureaucratic process .. Look it up it up it’s a fact ..

  32. Pat
    September 25th, 2011 at 05:11 | #32

    And Susan you say yOu can fire a union worker you just need a good reason thatsss not even close to true first of all to fire a teacher n a union there is a incredibly insane prOcess to go thrOugh and also spot of teachers have “seniority” which makes it even harder to fire them .. Also union bosses usually never fire teachers even if they show “Laziness, lack of performance, attendance” they just try n work with then to make them better I mean that is just bs any other job if you suck you are fired because u have a boss that can do that n a union job if u suck your boss probably have to go through 30 different people and processes to even attempt to can your ass.

  33. Pat
    September 25th, 2011 at 05:20 | #33

    It a fucking odor Barry 6 - There is no right of association. Even romance between men and women is often forbidden without approval. Is that really an argument against an big bad administration .. God just shut the fuck up u liberal idiot why dont u abed your Linds to these public schools and see how much they learn sure handfuls of kids do good at public school but not from the union teachers it’s from them working their ass off just like any of successful person you work hard and that’s why u a faggot union worker who just sits there with your thumb up your ass actually you probably turn a stool over and have a party

  34. Lily
    August 18th, 2012 at 13:26 | #34

    What does this have to do with unions? Nothing. You’re avoiding the issue. This sad, mistreatment of students and injustice has to do with the maxim “innocent until proven guilty” and how our laws and courts work at times ineffectively. This is an obnoxious straw man fallacy.